but when the bashing gets really intense, it can be hard. I think it's one part over-identification ('not my guy!') and one part discomfort with other fans' over-identification ('it's only a comic book!').
Yeah, I know exactly what you mean. And my over-identification always makes me feel hypocritical about criticizing other people's over-identification!
With Tony I find it doubly ridiculous, since a lot of the hate is based on fictional politics. Especially when these people don't get as hot over real world political issues.
I think a lot of them equate the fictional politics with real world politics (SHRA = Patriot Act, etc.), which is why they get so hot under the collar about it. And it's safer, socially, to express disapproval for (or through) the fictional politics than the real ones.
I wouldn't mind it in the short term
Yeah, the short term is just angst fodder. Heck, it can even become actively slashy, because if they can reconcile from that, then their bond must be very deep.
but if it became the new status quo, I think it would make me very unhappy, very quickly, and not even from a shipping perspective. I don't want Tony to be an out and out bad guy. Being Captain America's antagonist long term would more than likely turn him into Doom-lite, because even if Brubaker was still on CA, and the Knaufs on DoS, the character still exist in other books. I mean, look at what Slott and JMS did to Tony's characterization in Civil War - an astonishing amount of hate comes from stories written by those two.
Yeah. *sighs* Once upon a time I adored everything JMS did. I still like his TV and his novels and his original comics, but whenever he handles an existing character it goes in directions I'm not happy with.
Anyway, when you've got a character who is so central that he almost has to appear in everyone else's books, it's a no win situation. The title characters of those books have to be the heroes, which means Tony has to be either a bystander, a victim, or an antagonist. And he doesn't work very well in the first two roles. (Well, he works well as a victim, but his current framing doesn't allow for other heroes saving him very often.)
I am sad that Tony continues to fail to be hot, though. I normally find him very attractive, but in this art he's just normal.
Tragedy! ;)
*laughs* Hey, it's a visual medium! I want my eye candy. *g*
no subject
Yeah, I know exactly what you mean. And my over-identification always makes me feel hypocritical about criticizing other people's over-identification!
With Tony I find it doubly ridiculous, since a lot of the hate is based on fictional politics. Especially when these people don't get as hot over real world political issues.
I think a lot of them equate the fictional politics with real world politics (SHRA = Patriot Act, etc.), which is why they get so hot under the collar about it. And it's safer, socially, to express disapproval for (or through) the fictional politics than the real ones.
I wouldn't mind it in the short term
Yeah, the short term is just angst fodder. Heck, it can even become actively slashy, because if they can reconcile from that, then their bond must be very deep.
but if it became the new status quo, I think it would make me very unhappy, very quickly, and not even from a shipping perspective. I don't want Tony to be an out and out bad guy. Being Captain America's antagonist long term would more than likely turn him into Doom-lite, because even if Brubaker was still on CA, and the Knaufs on DoS, the character still exist in other books. I mean, look at what Slott and JMS did to Tony's characterization in Civil War - an astonishing amount of hate comes from stories written by those two.
Yeah. *sighs* Once upon a time I adored everything JMS did. I still like his TV and his novels and his original comics, but whenever he handles an existing character it goes in directions I'm not happy with.
Anyway, when you've got a character who is so central that he almost has to appear in everyone else's books, it's a no win situation. The title characters of those books have to be the heroes, which means Tony has to be either a bystander, a victim, or an antagonist. And he doesn't work very well in the first two roles. (Well, he works well as a victim, but his current framing doesn't allow for other heroes saving him very often.)
I am sad that Tony continues to fail to be hot, though. I normally find him very attractive, but in this art he's just normal.
Tragedy! ;)
*laughs* Hey, it's a visual medium! I want my eye candy. *g*