Entry tags:
feedback: make it fun and easy
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif){kind=small}
amberlynne's written a post about feedback that's being linked around. I disagreed. Her central point is this: readers should comment and they should do so in a way that the writer will be comfortable with. She goes on to say that comments should focus on the story. They shouldn't, for example, be addressed to other readers unless a direct comment is also left. They shouldn't be off topic, and they should as much as possible, be in a form that the writer will appreciate. Save that concrit for when it's been explicitly made welcome.
I think there's a point at which the proliferation of rules for commenting, soft or hard, implicit or explicit, starts to discourage comments.
1. I'm just gonna lay it out, the more you tell me what form my comment should take, the less likely am I to comment at all. This is, I think, especially true of people new to fandom, who are already confused by new social rules. Fandom's rules for feedback (some honey with the vinegar, no concrit unless asked for, direct reviews > talking with other readers) are NOT intuitive. "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all," tends to fall by the wayside sometime in middle school/junior high. High school art and writing classes encourage students to share honest feedback. Lit classes train students to believe that discussing a work with each other, and not with the writer, is of real value. The internet itself encourages many-to-many conversations, even when the creators are present and talking up a storm. We've been told for years that it's not all about the artist, and that it's really about the work. So take it as written that there will always be people who just don't get what you're talking about. Take it also as written that your going to get some backs up, when you tell people how they should be commenting.
2. People should comment more, and they should be polite when doing so. There's no call for flaming and this IS intuitive. Beyond that I don't think we as a group, should be restricting discussion of fanfiction, either in the comments to the story, or on other journals. Set up whatever rules you like in your own spaces, but please, don't set it up as simply being The Way Things Should Be always and everywhere. My stories are not sacred, and neither are the comment spaces. I mean look, I put that stuff on the internet, and it's just a fact that one day, someone will say something about it that I don't like. I've made my peace with that. I've made my peace too, with people just plain not liking my stories. They're allowed to dislike my stuff, and they're allowed to tell me that. If comment spaces are going to be about the writers as much as they are about the stories, then frankly in my opinion, the readers should get a share too. Talking amongst themselves, going off topic - these are natural parts of a vibrant conversation. If my stories get people talking to each other, as much or more as they encourage people to talk about the stories themselves, then I'm ok with that.
3. In case you hadn't guessed by now, I like critical discussion of fic, and I'd like to see more of it. Telling readers that they're doin it rong is a good way to discourage critical discussion in general. If you don't want criticism in your comments, note that in your header. Do NOT try to assert a moral obligation for readers to keep their silence ("If you don't have anything nice to say..."), in order to protect writers from embarrassment. No such obligation exists. There are spaces in fandom where this is the rule, and there are spaces where it is not. You can make your space fit your needs very easily, by just saying, "No public crit please," without shaming random passerby who don't know what your needs are. By doing so, you're leaving the rest of us free to have critical discussions without worrying about the consequences. I want to be able to say, "I think this would have worked better if..." without second guessing myself. If you make it clear that you personally don't want to receive critical feedback, you're making things better for both of us. I know what you want and don't want, and can take my criticism elsewhere. You, meanwhile, will get the kind of feedback that you like.
4. So long as readers are minimally polite in their comments and behaviour, they've fulfilled their social obligation to you. There is no other obligation between writers and readers. Writers need not produce more content, and readers need not comment. Nobody in this equation has to do anything; they post fic and comments out of passion and interest. Pressuring people into commenting more will not lead to the thoughtful reviews that all writers crave. And if the idea is that readers should comment on everything they read, and not say anything that could potentially embarrass the writer, then you're asking for them to lie. I read lots of stories that I don't like. Sometimes I want to see where things are going, or see just how bad things can get. Should I comment to that effect, or make something up? "I like your formatting." Sometimes I love a story, right up to the end, where it all goes sideways for me. "I liked this. Kind of."
5. Readers are under no obligation to comment, and all the numbers I've seen suggest that most readers don't. One of the best solutions to this was someone advocating end of story anonymous polls. (I can't remember who it was, though I found the post through metafandom?) The options were things like: I read this, I liked this, I didn't like this, ticky box. I love this idea! Not enough that I'm going to use it on my own stories, because I am so freaking lazy, but seriously people. This is a good idea. If you want the lurkers to give you some feedback, this is a great way to go about it. You've made it easy for them, and removed the potential 'costs' of commenting. They don't need to worry about delurking, only to receive a negative response. In the comments to
amberlynne's post, ![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
elspethdixon pointed out that favourites lists on sites like FFN and AO3 (that alert writers when they've been added) have the same effect as an "I liked it!" review. This is another no-pressure, generally cost-free way to give feedback. And it is feedback - it tells you that someone liked your story enough to add it to their favourites. The bottom line is, you have offered your writing for free on the internet, where people from within and without fandom can access it. Some readers are familiar with the rules of feedback in fandom, and some aren't. Some readers are determined lurkers. You want something in return for your efforts, but you can't force people to give you feedback. Your options are: a) begging; b) pressuring; c) being welcoming; d) making things fun and easy. Put yourself in the shoes of a reader who only infrequently comments. Which of these would most likely get you to comment?
no subject
no subject
no subject
I'm also considering writing up something about your point #3 in regards to the privilege of politeness, and the value of talking about harmful tropes publicly.
Or not, I may not have the energy.
no subject